tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post594760384236081976..comments2024-03-27T04:12:56.499-07:00Comments on Railfan44's Railroad Photo Essays: the stories behind the pictures: Major Passenger Train Wreck, Montgomery, IL, September 27, 1964Story Behind the Pictureshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13716784079436827968noreply@blogger.comBlogger27125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-21564741842779317772021-02-20T10:47:54.055-08:002021-02-20T10:47:54.055-08:00Thank you for your kind words about George Donalds...Thank you for your kind words about George Donaldson. He was a grand-uncle of mine, and I fondly remember the times when he and his wife Ethel joined in family get-togethers, and when visiting their home and in Galesburg, especially operating George's model railroad in the basement. I'm not a railroad man, and find it hard to fully understand what happened that day in 1964. The shock in the family was magnified when his brother-in-law Ghlee Wilson was killed in another train collision near Maquon, Illinois in 1972. We try to remember the good times though.<br /><br />Tom Arnold February 20, 2021Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02666937835891417453noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-83282873724327803762021-02-13T05:38:01.673-08:002021-02-13T05:38:01.673-08:00Hi Greg. I'm a retired Engineer from CB&Q/...Hi Greg. I'm a retired Engineer from CB&Q/BNSF. I first worked for CB&Q in 1969. I'm curious if I knew your wife's grandfather. What was his name?R.A. Smithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02231744133802637636noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-33253591930267334492021-01-16T13:59:05.426-08:002021-01-16T13:59:05.426-08:00I was 3 when my mother and I were in this trainwre...I was 3 when my mother and I were in this trainwreck. She told me our traincar was slung sideways across the tracks. but we were not hurt. I'm fascinated by this story.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03057558681465646390noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-71291176465320538212020-10-04T20:43:16.505-07:002020-10-04T20:43:16.505-07:00I worked for the Rock Island in the early 70’s as ...I worked for the Rock Island in the early 70’s as a fireman and when I was an engineer trainee, I worked with Don Blazer and it was his brother, Jim Blazer, that was the fireman on the Rock Island passenger train that had been back on the third unit when the collision occurred. I can remember waving to the widow of the engineer that was killed on the Rock Island passenger train who lived in Mokena. All the engine service guys would wave at her when we went through town. Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00083159367367097231noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-15727823640992973622020-08-28T00:45:57.877-07:002020-08-28T00:45:57.877-07:00George Donaldson, the engineer of the Westbound Ze...George Donaldson, the engineer of the Westbound Zephyr, was a family friend of my best friend when we lived in Hinsdale. I met him a few times. A really nice man. He was still qualified to run steam engines and ran the 5632 on several excursions that I was aware of. BTW, 1964 was a magical time on the CB&Q along the racetrack in Hinsdale. Most of the time, you could look down the 3 track mainline and see at least one headlight, quite often in both directions. Besides a ridiculous number of commuter trains to Aurora, there were all the Zephyrs, The Great Northern Empire Builder, a few mail trains and of course the freights. Just for good measure, throw in the 4960 and the 5632 running to and from the Clyde servicing roundhouse to a healthy number of steam excursions. The excursions ended shortly after George Donaldson's death due to Louis Menk, a new President of the railroad who apparently disliked anything but freight. He was hated by rail fans and a number of commuters who spotted "Menk is a Fink" buttons.<br /><br />Sometime in the '80s, I believe there was an article in Trains about someone who actually kept track of all the trains on that section in a 24 hour period. If memory serves, the count was 202. This was definitely a reduction from the '60s as there were no more excursions, only a few ling distance trains and of course no mail trains. <br /><br />I have never forgotten Mr. Donaldson and of course his death. Really heavy stuff for an 11 year old.<br /><br />Rowland Sharp August 28, 2020Rowland Sharphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10110308349470698495noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-85495955234379986412020-07-17T13:49:10.704-07:002020-07-17T13:49:10.704-07:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15819497117625719691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-90324117608982481492020-05-17T12:21:48.537-07:002020-05-17T12:21:48.537-07:00feel really bad when loved ones are lost, gent in ...feel really bad when loved ones are lost, gent in the tower that night lived across the street from a relative, no tradgedy is just one thing , its a number of things , they were implenebting a new system , iv seen a traffic light go from green to red without going yellow dirstracer xhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01652875504225660882noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-2771254481101965632019-12-22T23:47:14.187-08:002019-12-22T23:47:14.187-08:00Hello; I've had a hardcopy (photocopy) of the ...Hello; I've had a hardcopy (photocopy) of the report for some time, but couldn't find it. This scan is from an original, so it's better than what I had before!<br /><br />The link works for me if you take the final period off:<br /><br />https://www.jonroma.net/media/rail/accident/usa/icc/Ex%20parte%20244.%20CB%26Q.%20Montgomery%2C%20IL.%201964-09-27.pdf<br /><br />If that still fails, try<br /><br />https://www.jonroma.net/rail/accident/<br /><br />and scroll down the page to "United States (ICC)". The Montgomery accident is the last one under that category.JRRhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09419423175394834211noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-24651176357464146432019-12-22T23:36:00.789-08:002019-12-22T23:36:00.789-08:00Sorry, I cannot open the link... I've had a co...Sorry, I cannot open the link... I've had a copy of the accident for years. I could have sent it to you, but didn't know you were lookin for one.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12725706947438909562noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-4014180483401123612019-12-22T10:34:54.689-08:002019-12-22T10:34:54.689-08:00It took a bunch of librarians – both here at the U...It took a bunch of librarians – both here at the University of Illinois in Urbana-Champaign and at Stanford University in California – to ferret out a copy of the accident report on the Montgomery false proceed and ensuing head-on collision.<br /><br />I've uploaded the accident report to my website at https://www.jonroma.net/media/rail/accident/usa/icc/Ex%20parte%20244.%20CB%26Q.%20Montgomery%2C%20IL.%201964-09-27.pdf.<br /><br />Let's also take a moment to remember the four dead railroaders:<br /><br />Russel Reeves of Mokena (the CRI&P engineer on the detouring eastbound Rock Island train)<br />Robert Parker of Aurora (the CB&Q engineer pilot on the detouring eastbound Rock Island train)<br />George Donaldson of Galesburg (the CB&Q engineer on westbound Zephyr). <br />George Lincoln of Galesburg (the CB&Q fireman on the westbound Zephyr). <br /><br />240 people (passengers and railroad employees) were injured, with five cases still hospitalized 48 hours after the accident.<br /><br />As someone who follows railroad signaling technology (and assists in the teaching of the subject to engineering students), I am extremely interested the chain of events that led to the false proceed indication that allowed the Zephyr to run at speed through a diverging switch and to run into the standing Rock Island train.<br /><br />The engineering process involved in designing, installing, and maintaining a safe signal system sets rigorous standards for what are termed "vital circuits". Their proper function is intended to prevent an unsafe, life-threatening state.<br /><br />The term "indication locking" is a signaling fundamental whose purpose is to prove that a movable appliance like a switch or like a searchlight signal mechanism is actually in conformance with the the position requested before displaying a signal.<br /><br />Signal circuit designs are routinely checked by two or three senior signal engineers in the design office before being released to the field, and on-site signal supervisors provide an additional opportunity to check the design for proper function. There is thus normally several stages where someone could have said "Wait a minute – this isn't right."<br /><br />Something clearly went badly wrong at the Burlington's signal department that led to the Montgomery accident that "couldn't happen."<br /><br />Unfortunately, with the passage of 65 years, I doubt we will ever find out exactly what went wrong in the design and installation process that permitted a signal installation that caused a head-on collision, and the death of four railroaders and injury to a couple hundred other people.JRRhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09419423175394834211noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-64622620081035349092019-09-24T05:59:20.364-07:002019-09-24T05:59:20.364-07:00Oops, I'm not unknown, I'm Rusty Parsons.Oops, I'm not unknown, I'm Rusty Parsons.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08210660722692594414noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-61587067079690154142019-09-24T05:56:42.544-07:002019-09-24T05:56:42.544-07:00I really enjoyed your article. Being an 11 year ol...I really enjoyed your article. Being an 11 year old living 2 blocks away on River Street, the sound shook me out of my bed. I was probably one of the first people on the scene. The Beyer family lived in the house that backed up to the scene. They were close friends of mine. Lots of chaos and confused people. I'll never forget it. Thanks for sharing this insight into the causes.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08210660722692594414noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-33474504568632416032019-05-13T03:56:51.777-07:002019-05-13T03:56:51.777-07:00Great job for publishing such a beneficial web sit...Great job for publishing such a beneficial web site. Your web log isn’t only useful but it is additionally really creative too. There tend to be not many people who can certainly write not so simple posts that artistically. Continue the nice writing <a href="https://www.mosscolella.com/railroad-fela-claims/" rel="nofollow">Moss And Colella</a><br />Rodney Tapleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12870271205229303215noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-91498812634816095842018-12-23T14:54:34.420-08:002018-12-23T14:54:34.420-08:00I would like to add a few details if the 1965 Trai...I would like to add a few details if the 1965 Trains is not available. When this was an all mechanical plant it took 2 levers to switch turnout 14 from normal to reverse or back. Number 14moved a length of pipe line the few inches that the switch points needed to move and moved the points. Number 15 moved similar pipe line and a locking mechanism at the points so they stayed put. When a mchhanical plant there was no delay between moving the points and locking them in place. BUT when 14 was converted to electric the ICC found there was a 2.6 second delay after the lever in the tower was moved before the points moved and if the latch on the lock lever was moved in that 2.6 seconds the points would not move but the tower levers would say they had do a clear signal could be given when only a restricting signal was proper. The railroad placed a note on the model board that 15 should not be moved until 14 had indicated it had completed it's movement. The night of the tragedy 14 had been reverse because of a prior move, it was normalled and 15 was reversed to lock it normal before the switch was actually normal so a clear signal was given into an occupied track over a reversed switch.Tom warginhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13280321078003302853noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-75336536016740659012018-12-23T13:27:50.457-08:002018-12-23T13:27:50.457-08:00I have a copy of the ICC ACCIDENT REPOTTI have a copy of the ICC ACCIDENT REPOTTTom warginhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13280321078003302853noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-71726424490255941722018-02-14T00:16:53.036-08:002018-02-14T00:16:53.036-08:00I know – it's maddeningly missing from what is...I know – it's maddeningly missing from what is otherwise a pretty complete collection on the DOT site. If all else fails, the library here has a complete set of ICC accident reports.JRRhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09419423175394834211noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-20754597811868261472018-02-14T00:06:40.488-08:002018-02-14T00:06:40.488-08:00i can't find the ICC Report online at DOT.i can't find the ICC Report online at DOT.Story Behind the Pictureshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13716784079436827968noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-84388531179313345342018-02-13T20:47:19.116-08:002018-02-13T20:47:19.116-08:00Long ago, I know I had a copy of the ICC accident ...Long ago, I know I had a copy of the ICC accident report on the Montgomery wreck. I'd be happy to share it, but I have no idea where it is hiding in my house. :-(<br /><br />I used that article to write an analysis of the wreck in a newsletter that I put out about interlocking towers some 25 years ago. I know I have a copy of the article, and will share if there's interest.JRRhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09419423175394834211noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-42805473125742903722017-06-29T21:52:05.844-07:002017-06-29T21:52:05.844-07:00The Rock Island fireman survived due to alarm bell...The Rock Island fireman survived due to alarm bell sounding about the time the Q train first came into view. He found the steam generator on the 750 had shut down. He had refilled the tubes and just turned the switch from refill to start position when the wreck occurred. He woke up in hospital a day or two later and thought the boiler had blown up. This information was related to me by his brother who was also in engine service on RI.<br /><br />When the ICC accident report was released I was 3rd hours operator/leverman/clerk at Thornton Jct, Il on GTW. Every leverman had to read and sign that they understood the cause of the accident.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12766996791795868935noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-86031818242682514852017-03-09T08:56:13.961-08:002017-03-09T08:56:13.961-08:00That's OK.
Thx for taking the time to reply.
...That's OK. <br />Thx for taking the time to reply.<br />GregAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-81949545929596298262017-03-09T08:42:27.412-08:002017-03-09T08:42:27.412-08:00Hi Marty
I tried this last night, but I'm not ...Hi Marty<br />I tried this last night, but I'm not sure I did it right.<br />I came across this site while doing some genealogy research on my wife's grandfather, who was a CB&Q engineer in Illinois.<br />I am hoping to find a copy of the ICC Accident Report. All of the Google links that I could find don't appear to be active.<br />Is there any website, person or group that may be able to help me? (a .pdf, .doc etc... would work)<br /><br />Thanks in advance<br />GregAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-68433532308422862892017-03-08T20:37:04.881-08:002017-03-08T20:37:04.881-08:00I would assume the Library of Congress has a copy ...I would assume the Library of Congress has a copy and they are searchable on-line. Also a university with a strong transportation program like MIT, Northwestern, U of Illinois, or UCLA would have a copy in their library.<br /><br />Sorry, I know that's not much help.Story Behind the Pictureshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13716784079436827968noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-14019537956245904162017-03-08T18:50:13.836-08:002017-03-08T18:50:13.836-08:00Hi Marty
Fantastic story. I found a reference to ...Hi Marty<br />Fantastic story. I found a reference to this accident while doing some genealogy research on my wife's grandfather, who was an engineer on the CB&Q.<br />I was hoping you could help me find a copy of the ICC Accident Report about this accident. All of the links that I found on the net are "not found".<br />Again, great work.<br />Thank you<br />Greg HeseltineAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-63777644680682332172016-03-17T21:29:35.281-07:002016-03-17T21:29:35.281-07:00I assume it happened not long after the wreck and ...I assume it happened not long after the wreck and the changeover to CTC was what allowed the wreck. CTC is centralized traffic control meaning one dispatcher runs the whole railroad (signals, switches, etc.) for many miles.Story Behind the Pictureshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13716784079436827968noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6049190849010307394.post-58610931986896394192016-03-17T20:56:40.734-07:002016-03-17T20:56:40.734-07:00Do you know when the tower in Montgomery was remov...Do you know when the tower in Montgomery was removed from service? I remember the story in TRAINS. I would've been 13 at the time.John Richmondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13587302719107504726noreply@blogger.com